Comments on: Uh-Oh http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/ First in Music Analysis Sun, 12 Feb 2012 14:40:33 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: John Scher http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-86 John Scher Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:16:34 +0000 http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-86 The problems are REAL and the causes are many. All the issues including the <br />state of radio, lack of artist development at major lables, Promoter <br />consolidation and the greed that resulted to try and justify the acquisition (whether it <br />be concert companies or tours), Artist greed, Manager greed, Agent greed, <br />lack of understanding of the audience that is being targeted. It goes on and on. <br />BUT the answer is quite simple. RIGHT ARTIST presented in the RIGHT VENUE at <br />the RIGHT TICKET PRICE on the RIGHT DATE! Everyone would be quite surprised to <br />find that the fans will come out in droves if we could go back to these simple <br />rules. The problems are REAL and the causes are many. All the issues including the
state of radio, lack of artist development at major lables, Promoter
consolidation and the greed that resulted to try and justify the acquisition (whether it
be concert companies or tours), Artist greed, Manager greed, Agent greed,
lack of understanding of the audience that is being targeted. It goes on and on.
BUT the answer is quite simple. RIGHT ARTIST presented in the RIGHT VENUE at
the RIGHT TICKET PRICE on the RIGHT DATE! Everyone would be quite surprised to
find that the fans will come out in droves if we could go back to these simple
rules.

]]> By: Jack Orbin http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-85 Jack Orbin Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:16:16 +0000 http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-85 Great comments. But a couple important issues are missing.  First, I was <br />fortunate enough to own 5 clubs back in the late '70's to the mid '80's. It was <br />where U2, Rush, Peter Frampton, Bon Jovi, Judas Priest, etc. honed their live <br />skills to go on to LEGITIMATELY headline and sell out arenas. Being promoted <br />properly in small then bigger then big venues helps build a fan base that follow <br />those that care enough about their music AND the environment they are playing <br />in that concludes in, again, LEGITIMATE headliners. (Did I mention ticket <br />prices for U2 were less than $10?) And, importantly, we didn't cater to 14-16 year <br />olds (no offense to them) but to 18-25 year olds!  And where are these clubs <br />today? And where are the Acts that want to take the time to build like that? <br />And then comes as important an issue as building the fan base through live <br />performances, AIRPLAY. And I don't mean massive, hear the same song every 42 <br />minutes airplay. I mean, as XM Radio calls it, Deep Tracks. I remember very clearly <br />when great new music was being played on one or more stations, but you had to <br />"find" it. But it was there. What Clear Channel has done to radio is a sin to <br />all of us who care about music.(and the next potential headliner) And let's <br />face it, Clear Channel has only done what any greed (I mean totally money) <br />oriented corporation who is allowed (where are you FCC?) to consolidate and make <br />generic almost all playlists would do.  We will never have tomorrow's <br />headliners with staying power until radio formats change dramatically. But that's an <br />entirely too long issue to delve into now. Suffice it to say, when the Artist <br />cares, when the DJ, once again, cares and has the flexibility to play true <br />up-and-comers, and the entire population MAKES the music industry listen, THEN we <br />will be back on the road to Acts (and music) that really counts. Great comments. But a couple important issues are missing.  First, I was
fortunate enough to own 5 clubs back in the late ’70’s to the mid ’80’s. It was
where U2, Rush, Peter Frampton, Bon Jovi, Judas Priest, etc. honed their live
skills to go on to LEGITIMATELY headline and sell out arenas. Being promoted
properly in small then bigger then big venues helps build a fan base that follow
those that care enough about their music AND the environment they are playing
in that concludes in, again, LEGITIMATE headliners. (Did I mention ticket
prices for U2 were less than $10?) And, importantly, we didn’t cater to 14-16 year
olds (no offense to them) but to 18-25 year olds!  And where are these clubs
today? And where are the Acts that want to take the time to build like that?
And then comes as important an issue as building the fan base through live
performances, AIRPLAY. And I don’t mean massive, hear the same song every 42
minutes airplay. I mean, as XM Radio calls it, Deep Tracks. I remember very clearly
when great new music was being played on one or more stations, but you had to
"find" it. But it was there. What Clear Channel has done to radio is a sin to
all of us who care about music.(and the next potential headliner) And let’s
face it, Clear Channel has only done what any greed (I mean totally money)
oriented corporation who is allowed (where are you FCC?) to consolidate and make
generic almost all playlists would do.  We will never have tomorrow’s
headliners with staying power until radio formats change dramatically. But that’s an
entirely too long issue to delve into now. Suffice it to say, when the Artist
cares, when the DJ, once again, cares and has the flexibility to play true
up-and-comers, and the entire population MAKES the music industry listen, THEN we
will be back on the road to Acts (and music) that really counts.

]]> By: Marco Torcasio http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-84 Marco Torcasio Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:15:58 +0000 http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-84 Something else I noticed that has been on my mind that relates... <br /><br />Los Angeles audiences suck ass.  I believe that for the most part there are <br />fans out there (like I consider myself) who know good music.  I have close <br />friends all over the country who all seem to be well versed in music trends...in <br />many cases more so than the people I work with.  Mind you, they're not trying <br />to engage you in a competition of "Let's See How Many Bands I Can Name That <br />You've Never Heard Of", which must be the dumbest misconception of label people.  <br />Oh, and by the way, if that super obscure band that I've been name-dropping <br />in every conversation for the last 3 months ever sells 500K...they will cease <br />to be cool.  Ridiculous.<br /><br />At any rate...I got side tracked.  I've seen 2 Drive By Truckers shows in the <br />last 4-5 months.  Sold out gigs at the Troub at El Rey.  They went on around <br />10PM at both shows.  I probably don't have to tell you that this is a band <br />with a dedicated fan base.  2 1/2 plus hours of brilliance.  I was blown away.  <br />The thought of leaving never entered my mind...how could you leave?  People <br />were packing it in after the first hour.  Walking out in droves.  The people who <br />stayed for the duration were feeling the same inspiration I was.  But where <br />are the rest of these enlightened fans. The same thing happen at the 2 My <br />Morning Jacket Shows, 2 Wilco shows, a Damien Rice where Herbie Hancock play a <br />45-minute improvisational set  with him....what the Fuck is going on.  I've <br />compared notes on the same tours in other markets with friends who saw the same <br />bands.  I'm usually regaled with comments like, "Yeah I had to stop drinking <br />because it was too packed to make my way to the bathroom at midnight"  Things I only <br />experience once when I tried to get back to my spot near the front of a open <br />polo field at a Springsteen show in Dublin.  And speaking of Springsteen, <br />wasn't he revered for playing those exhausting 3 hour shows.  NO ONE leaves a <br />Springs teen show early in Dublin, or Jersey, or Indy...just Dodger Stadium.<br /><br />Sorry for the tirade, I don't even know if I've made a point, much less <br />proven one.<br /><br />Love your posts. Something else I noticed that has been on my mind that relates…

Los Angeles audiences suck ass.  I believe that for the most part there are
fans out there (like I consider myself) who know good music.  I have close
friends all over the country who all seem to be well versed in music trends…in
many cases more so than the people I work with.  Mind you, they’re not trying
to engage you in a competition of "Let’s See How Many Bands I Can Name That
You’ve Never Heard Of", which must be the dumbest misconception of label people. 
Oh, and by the way, if that super obscure band that I’ve been name-dropping
in every conversation for the last 3 months ever sells 500K…they will cease
to be cool.  Ridiculous.

At any rate…I got side tracked.  I’ve seen 2 Drive By Truckers shows in the
last 4-5 months.  Sold out gigs at the Troub at El Rey.  They went on around
10PM at both shows.  I probably don’t have to tell you that this is a band
with a dedicated fan base.  2 1/2 plus hours of brilliance.  I was blown away. 
The thought of leaving never entered my mind…how could you leave?  People
were packing it in after the first hour.  Walking out in droves.  The people who
stayed for the duration were feeling the same inspiration I was.  But where
are the rest of these enlightened fans. The same thing happen at the 2 My
Morning Jacket Shows, 2 Wilco shows, a Damien Rice where Herbie Hancock play a
45-minute improvisational set  with him….what the Fuck is going on.  I’ve
compared notes on the same tours in other markets with friends who saw the same
bands.  I’m usually regaled with comments like, "Yeah I had to stop drinking
because it was too packed to make my way to the bathroom at midnight"  Things I only
experience once when I tried to get back to my spot near the front of a open
polo field at a Springsteen show in Dublin.  And speaking of Springsteen,
wasn’t he revered for playing those exhausting 3 hour shows.  NO ONE leaves a
Springs teen show early in Dublin, or Jersey, or Indy…just Dodger Stadium.

Sorry for the tirade, I don’t even know if I’ve made a point, much less
proven one.

Love your posts.

]]> By: Jason Dell http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-83 Jason Dell Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:15:34 +0000 http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-83 Live business imploding?  Eh.  I don't think so.  I see lots of encouraging <br />signs of a revival, and good efforts to tap into latent demand both within and <br />beyond my own company.  I believe very strongly that there is a vast pool of <br />demand for live concerts that simply has not been tapped into. <br /><br />Where is the promoter who can do to the concert business what Guy Laliberte <br />of Cirque du Soleil did to the dying circus business?  Instead of lamenting the <br />decline of the circus audience in the mid 1980s, he reinvented the show, <br />attracting people in droves at a price that was (is) many times greater than the <br />Ringling Brothers were charging. Everyone in our business should be studying <br />the hell out of Cirque du Soleil as an art, business, and philosophy.<br /><br />A few days ago, you wrote a very compelling note about conventional wisdom, <br />quoting John Kenneth Galbraith: "We associate truth with convenience, with what <br />most closely accords with self-interest..." Isn't it convenient that <br />conventional wisdom now blames shrinking concert audiences on prices, kids' obsession <br />with video games, and <gasp> the music itself. <br /><br />What if I told you that so far this year the artists whose ticket prices are <br />higher than last year are selling more tickets, while those who have <br />discounted their prices are selling fewer tickets.  What if I told you video games can <br />be used as a channel to promote live concerts -- that the distraction can <br />become the attraction and drive kids in droves to the venues.  What if I told you <br />that there is just as much good and great music today as there was twenty and <br />thirty years ago.  Would you believe it?  Could you believe it?<br /><br />I really enjoyed your note on "Freakonomics."  You said something about the <br />CD business that I hope lots of people in the LIVE business pick up on.  You <br />said: "Really, think about it.  For every person trotted out in the media who <br />says he'll never by a CD again, there are people trekking to the store, to BUY <br />discs.  Could it be that these people downloading were never really buying CDs? <br /> And that really, it's not an issue of a declining market, of eating away at <br />CD sales, rather this is an EXTRA MARKET THAT SHOULD BE TAPPED?"  <br /><br />Hmmmm.  How many people who have seen a Cirque du Soleil performance had <br />never been to see the Ringling Brothers' "Greatest Show On Earth" before?  How did <br />Guy Laliberte find all those people?  What compelled them to go to his show?  <br />What can we learn and use?  There's lots there. I wish more my friends and <br />colleagues would buck up and buckle down instead of resigning themselves to the <br />"fate" that the circus almost met in the 1980s.  If a bunch of clowns can get <br />reinspired to reinspire their audiences, then so can we.  I, for one, am <br />finding more to celebrate than lament in the live business right now. Live business imploding?  Eh.  I don’t think so.  I see lots of encouraging
signs of a revival, and good efforts to tap into latent demand both within and
beyond my own company.  I believe very strongly that there is a vast pool of
demand for live concerts that simply has not been tapped into.

Where is the promoter who can do to the concert business what Guy Laliberte
of Cirque du Soleil did to the dying circus business?  Instead of lamenting the
decline of the circus audience in the mid 1980s, he reinvented the show,
attracting people in droves at a price that was (is) many times greater than the
Ringling Brothers were charging. Everyone in our business should be studying
the hell out of Cirque du Soleil as an art, business, and philosophy.

A few days ago, you wrote a very compelling note about conventional wisdom,
quoting John Kenneth Galbraith: "We associate truth with convenience, with what
most closely accords with self-interest…" Isn’t it convenient that
conventional wisdom now blames shrinking concert audiences on prices, kids’ obsession
with video games, and <gasp> the music itself.

What if I told you that so far this year the artists whose ticket prices are
higher than last year are selling more tickets, while those who have
discounted their prices are selling fewer tickets.  What if I told you video games can
be used as a channel to promote live concerts — that the distraction can
become the attraction and drive kids in droves to the venues.  What if I told you
that there is just as much good and great music today as there was twenty and
thirty years ago.  Would you believe it?  Could you believe it?

I really enjoyed your note on "Freakonomics."  You said something about the
CD business that I hope lots of people in the LIVE business pick up on.  You
said: "Really, think about it.  For every person trotted out in the media who
says he’ll never by a CD again, there are people trekking to the store, to BUY
discs.  Could it be that these people downloading were never really buying CDs?
 And that really, it’s not an issue of a declining market, of eating away at
CD sales, rather this is an EXTRA MARKET THAT SHOULD BE TAPPED?" 

Hmmmm.  How many people who have seen a Cirque du Soleil performance had
never been to see the Ringling Brothers’ "Greatest Show On Earth" before?  How did
Guy Laliberte find all those people?  What compelled them to go to his show? 
What can we learn and use?  There’s lots there. I wish more my friends and
colleagues would buck up and buckle down instead of resigning themselves to the
"fate" that the circus almost met in the 1980s.  If a bunch of clowns can get
reinspired to reinspire their audiences, then so can we.  I, for one, am
finding more to celebrate than lament in the live business right now.

]]> By: Paul Rappaport http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-82 Paul Rappaport Mon, 06 Jun 2005 16:14:50 +0000 http://lefsetz.com/wordpress/index.php/archives/2005/06/01/uh-oh/#comment-82 I believe the answer to most of our ills is for us to start "giving" again <br />instead of "taking."  The industry was grown by people who had vision and wanted <br />to give and create a cool environment for all whether it was recordings or a <br />guy like Bill Grahm who CARED about his audiences and gave them events that <br />entered their hearts in a very real way.  Yeah, he made money doing it, but the <br />point is he was "giving" something to humanity not just taking as much money <br />as he could.  Even back stage was an event for the bands themselves.  I <br />remember standing backstage in Oakland watching Bruce with Ron Wood.  We had been <br />treated to a great meal and we were eating gelato that we both had just gotten <br />from and ice cream stand back stage!  Now, this back stage event cost Bill some <br />dough but man was it worth it for the GREAT vibe.  It just made all of us feel <br />so good.  Try and just get a fucking cracker with cheese backstage today.  <br />Way too many people are just interested in how much<br />coin they can glean not giving or creating anything great that makes everyone <br />feel better and takes us all (fans and industry people alike) to another <br />level. I believe the answer to most of our ills is for us to start "giving" again
instead of "taking."  The industry was grown by people who had vision and wanted
to give and create a cool environment for all whether it was recordings or a
guy like Bill Grahm who CARED about his audiences and gave them events that
entered their hearts in a very real way.  Yeah, he made money doing it, but the
point is he was "giving" something to humanity not just taking as much money
as he could.  Even back stage was an event for the bands themselves.  I
remember standing backstage in Oakland watching Bruce with Ron Wood.  We had been
treated to a great meal and we were eating gelato that we both had just gotten
from and ice cream stand back stage!  Now, this back stage event cost Bill some
dough but man was it worth it for the GREAT vibe.  It just made all of us feel
so good.  Try and just get a fucking cracker with cheese backstage today. 
Way too many people are just interested in how much
coin they can glean not giving or creating anything great that makes everyone
feel better and takes us all (fans and industry people alike) to another
level.

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